Wednesday, April 13, 2011

THE RELOCATION OF THE ARMED FORCES MEDICAL SERVICES OUT PATIENT CENTER

There have been several complaints raised by a number of retirees who are not particularly pleased with the current arrangement with regards to the relocation of the Out Patient center by the Malaysian Armed Forces Medical Services (MAFMS) out of Sultan Tengku Mizan Armed Forces Hospital (STMAFH).

With the opening of the new STMAFH at Wangsa Maju, Kuala Lumpur to replace the old and dilapidated Armed Forces Hospital at Kinrara, the general perception was that the new hospital would be the center for the treatment, care and rehabilitation for all medical related ailments affecting servicemen, their families and including retirees. It was to be the best equipped hospital to serve the Malaysian Armed Forces, to mirror that of the US Armed Forces Hospital that even serve the medical needs of its President.

The complain that I receive is specifically one that is related to the Out Patient center that was previously located at STMAFH, that has now being relocated to the old medical center at Mindef complex. Whosoever had this ‘marvel idea’ of relocating the Out Patient center back to Mindef had little inkling as to the problems faced by all those who are required to call at the Out Patient center for a medical checkup or an appointment, especially so for retirees and their spouses.

This relocation has upset many a retiree for the following reasons:

1. Getting into the Mindef is a hassle as they would have to get off their car and report to the Guard Room for identification before being allowed passage through the guarded entrance. Retirees are not given any special preference, even if they show their AF Pension Card issued by JHEV.
2. Having got into Mindef, they are then faced with locating a suitable parking space that in most instances is not available close to the Out Patient center. They will then have to double park, only to be chased off by the MP’s.
3. Having got to see the doctor, and if the doctor has prescribed to them some medicines, they would then have to travel to STMAFH to collect the medicines, as Mindef Out Patient center does not have a dispensary.
4. If the doctor so prescribe that a patient is required to have an x-ray taken, they will have to travel to STMAFH for an x-ray, and the results be referred back to the doctor at Mindef Out Patient center. This has been the arrangement because Mindef Out Patient center does not have the x-ray facility.

Prior to the relocation of the Out Patient center, retirees are much at ease because of the comfort that the new hospital offers. There is no hassle at the Guard House as one enters the hospital compound. Parking spaces are in abundance, both outdoor and covered. Getting from one point to another for a check-up or treatment is hassle free as it is all being done under a single roof. The ambience within the new hospital is one of tranquility and hassle free; something that all retiree would need in the final days of their life.

Please remember that as Armed Forces retiree, it is not sympathy that they need; rather it is understanding and care. And under the present medical arrangement that an Armed Forces retiree has to endure for their outpatient treatment, the MAFMS has certainly ignored the aforesaid basic need of retirees.

CRUSADE AGAINST CORRUPTION

23 comments:

mask said...

Dato', request permission to say something.
Nama pun Armed Forces Hospital, priorities are Armed Forces personnel and families. Most of the soldiers and officers and their families are staying in DTHO. Maybe the retirees can arrange something with the JHEV for easy access in to Camp KEMENTAH.
Thank you Dato'.

Arunzab said...

Dato',
You are absolutely right. Even as you get off your car at the guard room you have to first fill up a form then line up with all the other civilian wokers to get a pass. No preference here either, it is humiliating. One day I asked the guard (cpl) if I could have an extra form, so that on my next visit I will not have to spend time filling up the form and then Q up. The 'monkey' told me,"Tak boleh ini borang terhad" No reference was made to me as an officer,or was I call by rank. This I regard as 'kurang agar'. I have heard this from other officers too.

So much for the JHEV instruction (Penggunan Geleran Pangkat)ISSN: 1675-0960 BIL: 2/2009 which in part reads "Panggilan kepada bekas saorang pegawai ATM tetap tidak berubah dan kekal seperti mana semasa berkhidmat. This apparently has been approves my no other than the Majlis Angkatan Tentera pada 28 Sept 2007".

You have covered the other 'buggery' of retires very well and I have nothing to add except to thank you for high lighting this issue which makes life for retires more difficult than it already is.

Salam

Mej. A R Ramachandran (Retired) said...

I simply have to agree with you 100%

Noor said...

DATO'

Ini gila punya keputusan. Tak masuk dek akal.

Kamal Sanusi said...

Dato'

Even though I never visit the said Armed Forces Hospital, based on your information, the conclusion I can say here is that this action on relocation the out patient center is unacceptable to a normal wise people and GILA! + MENYUSAHKAN!!

However, it is not surprising news to me when those morons can ignore the welfare of active duty servicemen, who is those yg dah pencen.

Mengelikan when reading an article "Kebajikan Veteran ATM Terpelihara" Buletin Veteran ATM Bil 1/2009 compare to the actual treatment received by those veteran with 1001 kinds of red-tapes and bureaucracy.

Citing example, Pingat Jasa Malaysia pun nak kena memohon and have to wait for buy-election within the certain areas for veteran to receive it (Bil 3/2010)

1001 kind of documents required to apply for reimbursement on expenses incurred for emergency treatment in private hospital/clinic but at the end of the day, how on earth they could say "We lost the some documents. Please re-send" (Bil2/2010)

Request your permission to forward this issue to editor of the said bulletin to see whether they have that 2 balls to publish it.

I would say this bulletin has no quality articles other than cheap political motivated publicity on certain people only. Most of it are too good to be true.

Mawar_Rimba said...

Well gentlemen, what more can i say about you guys. Some of you calling the soldiers "monkey" and some of you calling them "morons". You people have served the forces before, you people should know the rules and regulation in a military camps.
You people are no more in the service, you people are called "CIVILIANS". Just follow the instructions. If you people need any special privilege, get the JHEV speak to the top brass. Don't start "bad mouth" the soldiers, their are just following orders.
Thank you Gentlemen.

Kamal Sanusi said...

Dato'

There are lots of different between current soldiers and servicemen who had served the country in those years. Different from mentality, spirit, team-work, the way being trained and many mores. Just look at the way she gave comment.

Citing example, current officers are good in golf only not in military aspect itself. Just like Mawar_Rimba who claimed to be in military as per her profile. No wonder nowadays, most of them dapat tauliah jangka pendek saja.

I hope that she joined military (as claimed) because she likes it and not because her inability to get other job. Currently, many people like Mawar_Rimba joined military with a mindset as civilian not as soldiers. This type of people are duri dlm daging in military. Very danger!!!.... Need to spray them with Buy-Gone.

My advise to Mawar_Rimba, if you are really in military, don't show your stupid mentality here. Read what the posting is trying to tell. Wait till you leave the service but I guess don't tell us that you got lots of money and family is org kaya. Your family kaya because those unsung heroes made it happened. Jgn lupa daratan dan asal usul.

It is not hash/rude to say that current military officers are no different with kau which definitely kena cucuk hidung, just like you. Hahaahaaa.....

Arunzab said...

Madam,
We all know that we are civilians you don't have to remind us, but we are also ex-servicemen and expect some common courtesy from an establishment where we once served all our adult life. When an Other-Rank hands you a pass after knowing that you are a retired army officer, deliberately chooses not to address you as such, not even by your rank, then I will label him as 'kurang hajar'. Let all those in service now be reminded that one day they too will retire and be civilan/ ex-servicemen it is just a matter of time.
Thank you Madam

benadam said...

Wau!!!…this is getting to be very interesting and had in a manner of speaking taken away my self-imposed “innocent bystander” status and by extension gets dragged into the fray of these postings comments. Indeed I did experience the kind of reception described by Arunzab when accompanying a friend to the outpatient clinic at Mindef a couple of week back. I can accept to a point though, about our Madam’s comment that “their are just following orders.” But Madam, can’t they do it with decorum and the attitude that would best accompany such decorum is to be a solution provider as opposed to problems giver. Most of us are sexagenarians and all we asked is to be treated with a little more civility.
I am going to stretch my imagination a little for the benefit of our Madam and those who share her views. Let’s just say that for whatever reasons the big bike you are riding cannot performed the way you want it and you were thrown off the bike and landed under a 12 wheeler. By the grace of the Almighty you survived but you are not fit to serve the AF and declared a BE and eventually were medically boarded out. (There’s one such case, a Cpl in Mindef, who related his gruesome accident and waiting to be boarded out on a chanced meeting recently).
So Madam how would you feel if such treatment is being meted out to you while you are in a wheelchair or on crutches? Well in my case I just smile and say thank you and refrained from lowering myself to their level of rudeness. Period Madam.

taming said...

A very interesting development in MAF which dissapoints, frustrates and angers many people, both serving, retired military and their families.

I spoke to some people, including former PATs, Service Chiefs, Chiefs of Staff and DGs of MAFMS, who were responsible for the realisation of the Armed Force Hospital (STMAFH).
ALL exppressed the same feelings and disbelief at what MAF and DG MAFMS have done to relocate the out patient center to vintage WWII
substandard building used to house the Mindef RSAT.

Just because certain Mindef top brasses and PTD officers desire to have medical clinic close to their
backyards and DG MAFMS is facing manpower problem, the modern out patient center at STMAFH has been turned into a white elephant.
I invite YB Minister of Defence, PAT, Ketua Staf and DG AFMS to make an unannounced visit to the Mindef RSAT (or PPAT ) on any working day to witness the confusion and a pitiful state of affair.
Bloggers "mask" and "mawar_ rimba" may also join to see the "pasar borong" environment.
The conjested parkings (if any ), crowded waiting hall, corridors and poor toilet facilities do not speak well for an out patient center of a modern Malaysian Armed Forces!

The military retirees are no doubt "civilians" and I know they do not demand more than what they are entitled for and expect some respect. I feel really sorry if the serving military has turned
"kurang ajar" to the military retirees, especially when there are many whose hands used to feed some current senior brasses and steered MAF to what it is to-day! May be the PAT and Service Chiefs need to view such a case, if it really exists, time has come for their men and women to change their attitudes.

I hope DG AFMS, Lt Gen Dato Razak, returns to his sense to make a complete review of MAFMS manpower with the aim of turning STMAFH into the "Malaysian Armed Forces Hospital Center of Excellence". I see state-of-the-arc facilities at STMAFH and the MAF is not being fair to turn the out patient center into a white elephant.

I hate to see PM Najib offering STMAFH out patient center to Ministry of Health. Knowing the PM, he too hates to see any white elephant anywhere in the country, especially in the MAF.

tamingsari

ommo said...

Dato’ ,
I stand corrected
I agree with Mask and Mawar and in some way with the rest of you. Soldiers will be soldiers, i.e. no bad soldiers but officers, period. Different times different manners and culture. However JHEV can arrange for a special RSAT at STMAFH for veterans only as they are in the process for a Veteran Dispensary at the Hospital now, I which came across last week Tuesday. I am a bit apprehensive about this, too long to explain here. I also believe most soldiers are not rude, if proper sense of being human is applied. Ignore where necessary but be friendly (albeit firmly) when need to.

Arunzab said...

Kamal Sanusi, Bendam, and Tamingsari are are obviously well informed on the subject at hand and have given their views in a very rational and constructive manner.They have said all that needs to be said and now the ball is at the feet of DG AFMS, and Lt Gen Dato Razak to do the need full. Let see if they can take up the challange thrown at them by Tamansari.

Thank you gentlemen

Mohd Arshad Raji said...

Dear All,

Thanks for the comments. I sense there is a concensous that the relocation of the out patient clinic wasn't the right thing to do.

I would be writing to the Medical DG to express the concern of all, particularly from among the retirees.

taming said...

Dato',

Yes, we support your honourable effort to write to DG MAFMS to highlight the bloggers' views.

Additionally, many serving and retired military servicemen gave their support for Lt Gen Dato Razak to take strong professional stand to retain the STMAFH Out Patient Center.

Many serving military and veterans would respect DG MAFMS for the good cause of maintaining STMAFH Out Patient Center. In order not to disappoint certain Mindef bosses and brasses who desire to have a medical clinic by their
"backyards", I suugest a "small" medical and dental clinic is retained at Mindef RSAT.

Good luck to you Dato and DG MAFMS.

tamingsari

Mawar_Rimba said...

Just wondering out loud.... where did you people got your medical services before STMAFH, why can't you people just share the same facilities with the soldiers and family which is in Kem KEMENTAH. From what i see and observe you people are just asking for special treatment and to be treated special.
Kamal, do not compare soldiers zaman awak dengan zaman sekarang, memanglah beza, zaman awak soldier hanya pass darjah 6, now soldiers are SPM holders and some of them are Diploma holder. Zaman awak, soldier only carry SLR, now soldiers carry ATGW with M4. Zaman awak enemy just carry home made rifles, now our soldiers are facing enemies with AK 47s and RPG. PLEASE jangan bandingkan zaman awak dengan zaman sekarang.
One more thing Kamal, my family is rich because my Dad was also a soldier.
Taming, nobody is trying to have medical clinics at the "back yard", the "BACK Yard" you mention happens to be the soldiers' and their families "Back Yard". Jangan Tamak. Soldiers and their families welfare comes first.

MAWAR__RIMBA
PARA
BE PROUD, STAY AIRBORNE

Mej. A R Ramachandran (Retired) said...

I am touched by the many sentiments expressed. Indeed, this is a very real issue. Now ,I question the decision that was made in the first place. Was it well thought out ( as in an appreciation), or was it a random, off-the-cuff idea. I certainly hope not. It is situations like these that make me remember the official graffiti in LATEDA - There is no rematch in war. We cannot go on making wishy washy peacetime decisions lest we end up with a "trained mind"of making hasty decisions. Remember - THERE IS NO REMATCH IN WAR!!!!

ommo said...

For info there is a Veteran Ward at STMAFH, but so far only one patient (as of last week) being held there. He is a retired Sgt left by his family.

Kamal Sanusi said...

Dato'

Nowadays, diploma & degree holder can be described as

QUANTITY = YES
QUALITY = QUESTIONABLE

What is so special having a diploma and/or degree where the passing mark/standard has been lowered to ensure many students obtain a higher grade whilst showing to the public that the mentris have done a great job?

With 1001 kinds of IPTS/IPTA in 1Malaysia with 1001 kinds of names, the education has become a profitable business where any dick, tom & harry including Mawar_Rimba can enroll in.

At the end of the day, the prestige of having the said diploma/degree is no more leaving the rate of jobless is getting higher & higher, as high as Mawar_Rimba can stay air-borned.

matador said...

Brothers and sisters,

The contributions of veterans cannot be denied, especially not by current serving members.

Directly or not, the veterans' also shaped the current institution through evolution as things just do not happen in a flicker, not in this nobel institution.

On the same note, the current member will shape the future. Are we going to shape a better or worst future? The answer is in the hand of the current members.

I have to admit that time changes a lot in the service while other still remains its status-quo, especially that benefit the institutions.

TQ to the veterans that taught us the importance of security. Are we doing grave sins by continuing the heritage that was taught to us? I dont think so. If we remember 302, I believe the veterans would appreciate what we are doing. Nevertheless, the manners in dealing with veterans or any other human being is unacceptable and should be dealt with. I believe the veterans knows better what to do with those circumstances, make an official report and not just whinge in cyberspace.

I am sorry to say that the veterans are no more a serving members. Forget about all the privy you used to get. Forget about entering any mil units at your pleasure and expect the whole bn to welcome you. Forget about having your PA or batman to arrange for appointments and force the other party to comply. Forget about not to have to queue to pay your bills. Obviously PERHEBAT failed to do the transformation.

On the issue of the out-patient clinic, personally I prefer to have at both loc. An hosp w/o an OPD is just incomplete. But for the welfare of some ten of thousand of current serving members and family also req detail considerations.

While the veterans have more options for treatment incl time, the current serving members have less of both. If we appreciate the shortage of doctors and medical staffs in Malaysia, we should understand why we cant have both. And if I have to make a decision, I would definitely remain the OPD at the current loc as it will benefit more human being as compared to the number of veterans seeking treatment.

On the issue of X-Ray and other labs req, I dont think its an issue as we have ample tpt to move them if req. If its an emergency case, the A&E department always aval.

If you asked me if I can accept the current treatment to veterans if I retire, obviously not. What option do I have? COA 1, influence and shape the future. COA 2, transform effectively in 3 months before retiring. COA 3, save a lot and buy more insurance policy so that I dont have to rely on PPAT or any other general public facy.

Arunzab said...

matador Fu yo you so clever you know veterans are now no more serving members, we did not understand what veteran means till you pointed it out to us . My fellow retires, Saudara Taming, Maj A.R. Ramachandran, Kamal Sansui & Benadam and I did not realise that. We honestly thought for a moment we were all still in service!!! Now now that explains why entering any military units at our pleasure cannot be done and why whole Battalions don't turn up to welcome us.
Another thing that we all did not realise till you told us was that, we STILL have our PAs and batmans at our service, only that we should forget about using them to arrange for making appointments etc for us. That's a shame actually, having then at your disposal and not putting them to good use, what a waste. Such sound intellectual advice can only be displayed by a no-less than a 'pukka serving officer' like you and the likes of you. By the way in most establishments we pay our bills electronically, or by taking a Q number we don't line up any more. Eh! thanks again man you are really great. May GOD the all mighty bless our armed forces. Amen.

matador said...

Tuan Arunzab,

Interesting enough coz I thought this blog is meant to fight corruption. Not realizing how corrupt you are. As I said, its an EVOLUTION. No wonder I and Mawar the like are `so rude and self- centred'.

Honestly Sir, for the past decades, I've seen some few great soldier like Dato' Pak Chat being welcomed even years after he left. I also seen those of you and the like who still think he direct those serving member as they wish. Unfortunately no one cares except what is left of their cronies. Fortunately your time have past and unable to corrupt the mind of the system.

I reiterate EVOLUTION. I thank you for making me a first class officer as may be yourself during your time. And that evolution has taught me to differentiate MAKE FULL USE and MISUSE. Accept the fact and move on.

Mawar_Rimba said...

Gentlemen, my apologies if i have said anything rude in my comments. I got nothing against the vets, my dad is also one. The vets should be given special privileges. Without you people we are nothing, but there are ways and mean to get things done, please don't simply condemn the soldiers and the leadership. If you gentlemen are still in the service you guys might also have reacted the way i did.
Thank You... PEACE NOT WAR
"WE ARE JUST SOLDIERS"

MAWAR-RIMBA
PARA
BE PROUD, STAY AIRBORNE

azmi said...

Dear all,
I have been visiting Kinrara since 1970s and when the new hospital in Wangsa Maju opened its gates, I was among the first few to check its facilities. Before this as a veteran, my family and I would seek medical treatment at Wardieburn RSAT which is near our home and later changed to the new hospital until we were told to move to Mindef. No problemo with us as we just revert back to Wardieburn. Tak larat nak pi Mindef too far for us.
So far the medical treatment I received both from RSAT and new hospital is without doubt, the best. I don't think its because I'm a vet but because these people are professionals. Syukur alhamdullillah.